In article <1f20nw0.tpzsc5nxrs08N%dempson@actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson wrote: > Steve Quarrella > wrote: > >> Huh? >> >> http://support.microsoft.com/directory/discontinue.asp >> >> There's a reference to Apple II and Apple /// Operating Systems. >> >> Since when? > > What is your question, exactly? How long have Microsoft discontinued > support for their Apple II and /// products, or what products did they > have in the first place? > > I don't know the answer to the first part, but I can think of at least > three products that Microsoft produced for the Apple II: Applesoft BASIC > (not much support required there), the TASC compiler, and the Microsoft > Softcard (CP/M). I'm sure there are others. I know a fourth product: A.L.D.S. (don't confuse with ADSL! :-) which meant "Assembly Language Development System". It ran under Softcard CP/M, and contained a Macro-80 assembler (M80.COM) modified so it also could assemble 6502 mnemonics - the .6502 assembler directive was added to the already present .8080 and .Z80 directives. It also had DDT65.COM, with which you could debug 6502 code from the SoftCard environment; it presented a user interface similar to the one in DDT. And I think it also contained CPMXFER, a program which should be transferred to a DOS 3.3 diskette and run from DOS 3.3 - from there it could transfer CP/M text and binary files to DOS 3.3. The A.L.D.S. came with a manual in the same neat small format as the manuals of Softcard CP/M itself. And then we had the Apple Softcard versions of Microsoft Fortran-80, Microsoft Cobol-80 and Microsoft Basic Compiler: compared to the standard versions of these products, support for Apple II screen control, graphics, sound and game paddle input was added. These Softcard specific versions of Macro-80, Fortran-80, Cobol-80 and Basic Compiler were considerably cheaper than the standard versions. They also had a check early in the program that it really ran on a Softcard CP/M system (the Z80 set a byte value somewhere in RAM, then a 6502 subroutine was called to set the byte to some other value, and finally the Z80 checked that the value really was changed; if not, the program was terminated). Which meant when I upgraded to an Appli-Card Z80 card, Macro-80 and Fortran-80 no longer worked. I sent a letter to Microsoft asking why, and receieved a response saying "the Softcard versions won't work on the Appli-Card, but the standard versions will work". I.e. MS wanted me to buy these products AGAIN, for a considerably higher price! I didn't do that of course; instead I searched the binaries for a Softcard 6502 subroutine call and found it pretty quickly; then I patched the binaries so this check was disabled, and lo and behold - everything then worked fine also under Appli-Card CP/M! ====================================================== And then there were also some Microsoft games for the Apple II: Microsoft Adventure (another verison of Colossal Cave), and Microsoft Olympic Decathlon. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Paul Schlyter, Swedish Amateur Astronomer's Society (SAAF) Grev Turegatan 40, S-114 38 Stockholm, SWEDEN e-mail: pausch at saaf dot se or paul.schlyter at ausys dot se WWW: http://hotel04.ausys.se/pausch http://welcome.to/pausch