KellihanB writes ... > > Hmm... I've tried using apple disk utilities to copy the whole disk and it > failed ... several times. I tried verifying that the disk is readable, and > it says the disk is damaged... Apple Disk Utilities is not really much good for tasks like this. For doing disk salvage type stuff you want something that will do a Disk Verify and show bad sectors and that will let you easily Read, Edit, and Write sectors. COPY II Plus-- version 7.x - 8.3 for DOS 3.3 and ProDOS is a good choice. Version 5.5 is better for just DOS 3.3 because the Sector Editor is included in the main Utilities. (In the ProDOS/DOS 3.3 versions, you have to select COPY--> BIT COPY to get to the utilities which include the Sector Editor.) Bag of Tricks and some other 'cracker' utilities look good in terms of offering more options; but, they are not as user-friendly and it's easier to mess up something by accident. Copy II Plus is available on Ground, Asimov, GSWV and other sites ... ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/images/utility/disk_utils/ ftp://ground.ecn.uiowa.edu/apple2/useful.stuff/Disks/ http://206.14.25.120/~cturley/a2zine/Utils/ Bag of Tricks with Docs is available in the GSWV archive at http://206.14.25.120/~cturley/a2zine/Utils/ .) > However, I'm not giving up on this disk yet... I've searched the web, > Asimov, and tried Tiktok (is it gone?) but the image isn't out there. I > guess this wasn't popular enough to image... It may just not have gotten much distribution. The only reference I've found to any game from Keypunch is a 1987 release of "Subnodule" (in The Giant List' at http://www.dadgum.com/giantlist/list.html ). 1987 was not a really good year to be selling 8-bit A2 software. > The good (bad?) news is I think I know how the disk was damaged. I was > playing a game of Chess and the phone rang. I didn't want > to play anymore so I hit CTRL-Apple-Reset > and then CTRL-Reset to drop into basic. I use a DuoDisk. .... > I'm going to try a file by file copy to a freshly formatted DOS 3.3 disk > using the ProDOS system utilities. (BTW: how do you do this from ProDOS? > Is it possible? Some utilities that start up under ProDOS (like later versions of Copy II Plus) can copy DOS 3.3 files. The ProDOS system utilities probably will not work with DOS 3.3 stuff. > Would copying a DOS 3.3 disk with ProDOS and then erasing it work?) .... You may be able to do a disk copy of some DOS 3.3 diskette; but, you could not do a ProDOS erase on a DOS 3.3 diskette. Anyway, it's a lot easier to just INIT a fresh diskette under DOS 3.3. Probably, your first test should be to boot DOS 3.3 from some good diskette, get to the usual Applesoft prompt (]), stick in your game disk, and try a CATALOG. If you get a nice listing of files, a bunch of possible barriers are eliminated. If you don't, then the questions are ... o- is the CATALOG track damaged (Track $11-- Track 17 in decimal) o- is the disk copy protected o- is the disk a ProDOS disk So, try booting ProDOS and doing a CAT for the disk. If you can not get a file listing under DOS 3.3 or ProDOS, the most likely explanations are that the game disk is copy protected or that the DOS 3.3 CATALOG or ProDOS directory is damaged. (There's a chance the game is on a Pascal disk; but, that is not very likely.) Either way, you can forget about doing simple file copies. A pretty good check for damage is to boot a util disk with Disk Muncher (available on TNILUTIL from Ground and GSWV) and try doing a disk copy using DM. If none of the tracks copy, the disk is probably copy protected. If all but one or two tracks copy, the bad tracks are probably where the damage is. If it looks like the disk is copy protected, you should probably look for some help. If it looks like the disk is not copy protected and only one track is damaged, you may be able to zero-in on damaged sectors (on the copy) and make repairs which will salvage most of the games or, maybe, all of them. Rubywand