AFL HypCrd: So, anybody heard any good Hypercard news? AFC Jeff : There's a new product out, called GestaltLook! which is a set of 58 externals... AFC Jeff : that provide access to the Gestalt Manager.... AFC Jeff : Looks like a knock-off of another set of Gestalt externals I know and love... JeffE99995: gestalt esternals???? AFC Jeff : The set sells for $49.95. AFC Jeff : I don't have the company name handy, but I'll get it and post it in the product folder. AFL HypCrd: Jeff...could you talk a little about what Gestalt is/does. AFC Jeff : Gestalt, which is present in System 6.0.4 and up... AFC Jeff : provides information about the macintosh, like the Mac type, ROM version, amount of RAM installed... AFC Jeff : In all there are 58 selectors built into system software... AFC Jeff : but it is extendable, one may add a Gestalt selector to identify their own software... AFC Jeff : It is basically used to test for features of the current environment. AFC Jeff : For example, by checking the AUXversion, you can tell if A/UX is running, and if so, what version... AFC Jeff : so if you are doing something that requires A/UX 3.0 and 2.0 is installed, you can alert the user AFC Jeff : that they need to upgrade. AFL HypCrd: I assume that this can come in very handy in network environments... AFL HypCrd: and when passing messages between machines and applications, such as AppleEvents. AFC Jeff : That would be a great application of Gestalt. AFL HypCrd: Jeff, do you sell your gestalt? AFC Jeff : I have put my Gestalt XFCN 2.3 and the other 49 seperate XFCNs into the ShareWare arena... AFC Jeff : licensable for as little as $5.00. AFC Jeff : Gestalt XFCN 2.4 is due out any day now... AFC Jeff : and is much more flexible than 2.3... AFC Jeff : for example, with 2.4 you pass the selector code that you want to find out about... AFC Jeff : if it's one that's known it returns a plain english response... AFC Jeff : if it's unknown, but present, it will return an 8-digit hexadecimal number with the result... AFC Jeff : interpreting that result would require that you know what to expect... but, there is a Gestalt AFC Jeff : selector added by things like After Dark, so if you wanted to test for that, you can with this XFCN. AFC Jeff : ga AFC Jeff : By the way... AFC Jeff : one notable licensee of my Gestalt XFCN is Claris Corp. for use in their troubleshooting stacks. AFC Jeff : ga AFL HypCrd: Frank, did you have some comments about XCMDs? AFC FrankV: Sure... AFC FrankV: Well let me first say that if you need an XCMD the first place to look is... AFC FrankV: the Rinaldi collection. AFC FrankV: Frederick (SP?) Rindaldi is without doubt the most prolific XCommander... AFC FrankV: out there. Pretty much if you need something he has probably done it. AFC FrankV: Our library contains at least 90 or so externals that do everything from copy/move files to... AFC FrankV: displaying specialized and customizable external windows... AFC FrankV: I personally always check out the Rinaldi collection before I write my own. AFC FrankV: One of the nice thing about his externals is that they are usually very well thought and as general AFC FrankV: as possible. You would be surprised at the number of very specialized externals there are out there. AFC FrankV: Many of these will only work in specific versions of the Mac OS and HyperCard, and many of them will AFC FrankV: actually crash your machine in the worst ways. AFC FrankV: As I mentioned the library has whole collection of his work... AFC FrankV: if you do a lot of HyperCard work then it is worth your while to download them. I know that he has AFC FrankV: saved me untold hours! AFC FrankV: Another good source of external commands is Nine to Five Software (Hi Carlos!). AFC FrankV: While Mr. Rinaldi's externals are shareware of Freeware in many cases, 925's stuff is commercial. AFL HypCrd: Does anybody have questions about XCMDs? AFC FrankV: However, 925 does some really nice things... Lookr : ! JoeSab : ? AFC FrankV: ga AFL HypCrd: Lookr Lookr : After last week's conf., I picked up Reports and I can't say enough good things AFL HypCrd: (Frank, we'll get back to Nine to Five) AFL HypCrd: Lookr....sure, go ahead...say some good things. What did you like about it? AFL HypCrd: What can reports do that is above and beyond the built in HC printing? Lookr : First of all..I don't have to script anymore for reporting features, but I can if I want. Mel Hoag : ? AFC Jeff : ?=JoeSab, Mel Hoag -- please wait for the go ahead Lookr : AFL HypCrd: Joe JoeSab : Are there any stacks out there that take advantage of the Color XCMD? I still can't figure out how... JoeSab : to use it with my existing stacks, and I can script pretty well. AFC Jeff : ! AFL HypCrd: Jeff Mel Hoag : ! AFL HypCrd: (Joe, you are referring to the Colorizing XCMDs?) JoeSab : Yes! AFC Jeff : At work we've got some incredible stacks that use ColorizeHC... AFC Jeff : It just takes a lot of patience in getting used to the multitude of parameters that can be used. AFC Jeff : If you have some specific questions, please post them so we can discuss them at length. AFC Jeff : ga AFL HypCrd: Melanie Mel Hoag : The stacks on the recent Apple CD-ROM Titles Sampler are "colorized". BradleyB13: ? AFL HypCrd: Melanie, did you have a question? Mel Hoag : How does one get the cd/bg pict within an external? It's compressed & need to work with it uncmp AFC Jeff : I've never done it Melanie, but I can do some scouting around and get back to you. AFC FrankV: Are you trying to get the card picture from your stack? AFC FrankV: I didn't understand the question. Mel Hoag : I need to get the cd or bg pict from within an external for custom printing. The cd & bg Mel Hoag : picts are compressed and I was told of a "secret" callback (GetMaskAndData) but can't find more. Mel Hoag : AFC FrankV: OK- There is no built in way (last I checked) to get the background picture, but there is a callback DDRUCKER : ! AFC FrankV: Yes, GetMaskAndData is it. It will only get the card picture however. (done) AFC Jeff : I think GetMaskAndData is for Icons... but I could be mistaken. DDRUCKER : <-- has a sort of a cludgy workaround Hanrek M : ! Mel Hoag : That's OK what is the syntax please (if not to long) and where is docs on it? AFL HypCrd: Mark Hanrek M : In the HyperCard File Library is my "System 7 Process Monitor stack. It has the CompileIt! source... Hanrek M : which shows exactly what you need to do. Hanrek M : :) AFL HypCrd: David DDRUCKER : If you can do a tool change to marquee, select all, copy, then you can work with the clipboard, which DDRUCKER : should be uncompressed. But it sounds like Mark has a better way. So... nevermind. (done) Hanrek M : Actually, the clipboard has many advantages! AFL HypCrd: Melanie...your question is a perfect lead in to some announcements... AFC FrankV: Actually david that would allow you to get the background if you did... AFL HypCrd: In other words, I don't have an answer, but... AFC FrankV: a callback for "set editBkgnd to true" first . (Done) AFL HypCrd: First, an Internet gateway is now available.... DDRUCKER : Cheers! AFL HypCrd: so it's possible to send mail to Mr. Rinaldi :) AFL HypCrd: I believe he has an Applelink account, which can be reached with a suffix of @Applelink.apple.com AFC Jeff : just use "@AppleLink" it'll get there. AFC FrankV: He is "Rinaldi1" i think. Mel Hoag : Sorry the system hung me so lost last few lines! BradleyB13: ? AFL HypCrd: I'm sure that Frederic would know what callbacks are available to do what you want. AFL HypCrd: Bradley BradleyB13: Other than the "Bond" book are there any books on writing XCMDs/XFCNS (especially in C)? AFC FrankV: ! AFL HypCrd: Frank AFL HypCrd: None that I know of. AFC FrankV: I have not seen any books other than "Bond", but... AFC FrankV: The CompileIt! 2.0 Manual is a very good source of technical information on the subject. (done) AFL HypCrd: There is a product out which attempts to teach XCMD development using examples... AFL HypCrd: It's called WildThings. AFL HypCrd: From Language Systems in VA @ 703-478-0181 Hanrek M : WildThings is in the Industry Connection Area. AFL HypCrd: The version that I have has a sticker that says "Now Supports Lightspeed C" :) DDRUCKER : ! AFL HypCrd: David DDRUCKER : Aren't WildThings XCMDs written DDRUCKER : in Fortran? DDRUCKER : (done) DDRUCKER : (I know, it was a question) AFL HypCrd: I don't know...would it make a difference? Hanrek M : Language Systems produces a Fortran Compiler as well. Hanrek M : ! AFL HypCrd: The product includes a disk which contains the source code for over 40 XCMDs. AFL HypCrd: Mark Hanrek M : My first experience trying to write XCMDs in C was awful... AFC FrankV: <-- Ditto! Hanrek M : ...but perseverence paid off... Hanrek M : by collecting every piece of source code I could, and playing with it. AFC FrankV: ! AFL HypCrd: Bradley...do you have Mac programming (toolbox) experience? AFL HypCrd: Frank AFC FrankV: Just a comment about 'C' and externals... BradleyB13: I've written a couple very simple XFCNS (in C), yes very painful. Hanrek M : ! AFC FrankV: 'C' is a great language, but Pascal on the Mac is just a lot easier to get into the learning curve AFC FrankV: with. BradleyB13: Very limited toolbox experience, due to lack of foraml programming training AFC FrankV: I actually "backed-up" to Pascal and things went a lot faster for me. (done) AFL HypCrd: Mark BradleyB13: and a tough time with pascal -> c conversions. Hanrek M : I think the critical factor was access to someone who could answer questions. No one was available.... Hanrek M : But you are welcome to lean on me. I've got it down pat now. I've even done trap patching and... Hanrek M : ...Apple event tricks with XCMDs. BradleyB13: be _carful_ of what you offer :) BradleyB13: er...careful Mel Hoag : ? DDRUCKER : Or people take it away by the car-ful, eh? Hanrek M : Written answers to questions are easy to come by. Finished results are way more difficult. :) AFL HypCrd: Melanie Mel Hoag : Anybody have experience creating a WDEF from scratch? Hanrek M : ! AFL HypCrd: Mark Hanrek M : Not 'zacktly. But there are examples avail in both C and Pascal... Hanrek M : ... and all you need to do is carve out the stuff you don't want and splice in what you do. Mel Hoag : I'm looking for a good Pascal example. Any suggestions? Hanrek M : There are examples on the Developer CD and probably in the Development Area of AOL under... Hanrek M : Apple Software. Let me know if you have trouble. I have a few I've collected for "that day"... Hanrek M : when it arrives for me. . DDRUCKER : I'll bet Leonard Buck (WindowScript) has had a lot of experience with it. DDRUCKER : He writes in Pascal too. Hanrek M : No kidding! Mel Hoag : Have the dev CDs - but haven't looked extensively? Have a pointer (no pun intended)? AFC FrankV: ! AFL HypCrd: Frank AFC FrankV: You might look in MacTutor archives they are always a good source. (done) Hanrek M : There is a "Windoid WDEF" which comes with the Think Pascal compiler. Papa wig : Hi! Mel Hoag : I have an older version of Think 'cause I use MPW but I'll check - thanks Papa wig : anybody interested in a live video action adventure? AFL HypCrd: Melanie...ask that question of AFL MacDev. Chris Allen may be able to help. Mel Hoag : OK - thanks all. ] Papa wig : is anyone? AFL HypCrd: Any other XCMD stuff? AFL HypCrd: Papa...live action? DDRUCKER : ? Papa wig : yes expressed with video Papa wig : color DDRUCKER : Papa - What kind of hardware do you need to experience it? Papa wig : I use XCMD stuff BradleyB13: ? Papa wig : floppy disks DDRUCKER : QuickTime? Papa wig : preferbly mac II or higher Papa wig : no just hypercard Papa wig : not sure if it works in black and white AFC Jeff : Sorry gang, I've got to run... it's been fun! AFL HypCrd: Jeff, Thanks! Papa wig : anybody sound interested? AFC Jeff : I'll be logging... Papa wig : nite, Jeff! DDRUCKER : How big is it? Papa wig : check out our folder! DDRUCKER : Where? Papa wig : hold on Papa wig : go dept. entertainment and software Papa wig : then Special interest groups Papa wig : no sorry Papa wig : dept entertainment and software, games and entertainment, special interest groups, game Papa wig : designers SIG, Papa wig : then game designers Papa wig : and then browse the folders Papa wig : 1st folder there! DDRUCKER : Got there. Continent Maker? Papa wig : D, read the messages and it will give discriptions and how to obtain it DDRUCKER : Got it. Thanks. Papa wig : its called "LIVE VIDOE ADVENTURE GAME Papa wig : are you there? Papa wig : anyone else interested? AFL HypCrd: LIVE instead of ? :) Papa wig : LIVE VIDEO Papa wig : sorry Papa wig : typing error Papa wig : anyone watchin the game? DDRUCKER : Yeah, BCS Frank : game? DDRUCKER : The Bulls are way ahead, Papa wig : too bad Papa wig : I'm for Portland Papa wig : Blazers have to tighten up on defense Papa wig : I gotta go Papa wig : nice talking to all of you DDRUCKER : OK, thanks for the tip. AFL HypCrd: Any other XCMD questions? EulindaG55: Hello ....I need help. How do I find the application for HyperCard 2.0?? DDRUCKER : ? AFL HypCrd: Eulinda...it can't be downloaded from an online service... EulindaG55: Oh....someone told me it could be DLed. Ok...thanks AFL HypCrd: You have to 'buy' it...or buy a product which distributes it.... EulindaG55: I had it but now I can't find it. AFL HypCrd: such as 9 to 5 Office, a Personal Information manager which sells for $10... AFL HypCrd: and includes Hypercard 2.1 :) Nine2Five : :) AFL HypCrd: David DDRUCKER : ? DDRUCKER : Anybody seen a dragrect DDRUCKER : XCMD that can drag between windows and works in SuperCard? DDRUCKER : (done) AFL HypCrd: Mark? :) BradleyB13: ? AFL HypCrd: Bradley BradleyB13: nevermind...too many C specific XCMD/XFCN ?'s, I think i'll burn up the e-mail with Hanrek M BradleyB13: i don't want to sound stupid in public :) DDRUCKER : That never bothered me. Mel Hoag : There never is a stupid question on the learning curve! DDRUCKER : Thanks Melanie. Someone needed to bail me out here. AFL HypCrd: Melanie...well said!!! Mel Hoag : I figure if you ain't gonna ask you ain't gonna learn! BradleyB13: ok...in a callback to hypercard BradleyB13: if you get a true or false response BradleyB13: how do yuou convert a boolean to a string? BradleyB13: I've asked for the hilite of a button, but, cannot BradleyB13: figure out what type of response i get back? Mel Hoag : BoolToStr(paramPtr:XCMDPtr; bool:BOOLEAN; VAR str: str255); in pascal Hanrek M : And vice-versa. :) BradleyB13: I have tried the C equivalent, but, cannot evaluate the response. BradleyB13: how would you determine the hilite of a button BradleyB13: and how is the information transferred back? (in what form) (in C)? AFL HypCrd: Gee, don't all jump in at once. AFC Jeff : The hilite of a button? AFC Jeff : I'd use... AFC Jeff : mystr:= evelexpr(paramptr,'the hilite of btn whatever'); AFC Jeff : then convert that to a boolean. BradleyB13: ...i've used EvalExpr which returns a handle to a string, but, i must be doing something wrong BradleyB13: because when i convert it to boolean it will not give me a true or false, i crash BradleyB13: not really crash...it will not evaluate right BradleyB13: BradleyB13: see, now i feel... BradleyB13: i'm trying to find a word different than stupid AFL HypCrd: Don't feel so dumb now that you know the 'experts' can't answer your questions? AFL HypCrd: Well, I'm going to call it an evening... AFC Jeff : I could do a quickie in Pascal tonite and post the source for you. Just to get the hilite of a button. BradleyB13: ok, thanks DDRUCKER : Thank, Peter. What's on tap next week? AFC Jeff : Frank wondered if perhaps you could pass the hilite as a parameter to your external? BradleyB13: it's really more than that, but, i'm hung on the boolean transformation AFL HypCrd: Next week is Sensible Software talking about a product called Bookends. BradleyB13: i'm setting up a dialog that pre-sets buttons based on t/f information in the stack AFC Jeff : I'll just do a little stack with some buttons, and write a test for the hilites and post it and the... DDRUCKER : Good night all. It's good to be back. AFC Jeff : source in Pascal, it might get you started anyway. DDRUCKER : See you next week (I hope). BradleyB13: thanks jeff AFC FrankV: 'night David Hanrek M : See ya. BradleyB13: 'night all