=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- APPLE II MUSIC & SOUND FORUM CONFERENCE LOG February 26, 1992 10 PM ET Topic: SoundConvert From Triad Ventures Forum Leader: Joyce Madden (AFL JoyceM), Forum Assistant: Gene Koh (AFA Gene) Forum Consultants: Greg Dib (ELECTMUSIC), Ed Rosenblatt (AFC Eddie), Lindsay Hough (LindsayGS) Copyright (c) 1992 America Online All Rights Reserved =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- AFA Gene Welcome to the Apple II Music Conference. Tonight our guest is Mike Nuzzi of Triad Venture, one of the leading producers of innovative IIgs productivity applications today. Triad's latest release, SOUNDCONVERT, is a powerful application that helps unlock the "holy grail" of IIgs music and sound... the ability to go beyond the constraints of interfering sound file formats through the use of a universal conversion program. Welcome, Mike! Any words to start us off? Nuzz Thanks Gene. I'd like to just say a few words on what SC does and does not do. Like the name suggests, SC will convert from various sound file formats to the rSound Format that HCGS and system 6 uses. You can import files from Hyperstudio, Bin, AE, Futuresound, and Midisynth waves (instruments). You can export rSounds back out to all the same formats except Midisnthwaves You can also digitize rSounds for use with HCGS and System 6. It supprts ALL sound cards for the GS. You can also muck around with the rSound Header ( at your own risk) Two of the authors are here tonight also. Steve Bernacki and Joey Schoeber. You might recognise them :) AFC SteveB :) AFC Eddie Steve and Joey - Great job!! Nuzz Steve, did I leave anything out? AFC Eddie Yeah, how about the NDA? AFC SteveB The NDA! Nuzz Oh, yes, It is part HCGS stack, and also has a Digitize NDA that does not require HCGS AFA Gene So, there are two components to the package: the main program which comes in the form of a stack and an NDA which performs equivalent functions for non rSounds are the type of sounds that system 6 supports. Nuzz Right Gene AFA Gene rSounds are a relatively new phenomenon in the IIgs community. Can you (or Steve or Joey) give us a quick overview of the format, its advantages, drawbacks? AFC SteveB (The NDA doesn't do -all- that the stack does...It mainly just digitizes.) Nuzz Gene, rSounds are sounds that are kept in the resource fork of a file. The main advantage is that it sets something of a standard. Something that should have been for a long time. The other advantage is that system 6 and HCGS and any other program can "talk" to each other and ask one another to play a sound. Disadvantage IMO, is that the sounds are stored in memory although they are purgable. AFC SteveB The only disadvantage in my mind is that the sounds are not compressed...and are quite big. Nuzz THey are not compressed,but they are not any bigger than other sounds. rSounds also introduce a Rel-Pitch" feature to tune the sample to other values AFC Eddie How does the Rel-Pitch work, Mike? Nuzz well, system 6 and HCGS always play a sample at 26300 Hz, and to compensate for samples digitized at other rates, rel-pitch field would correct the sample to play at the original rate (or make it sound like that) ELECTMUSIC So Mike, Will take longer to boot up the system software because of the sounds? Nuzz Not much longer, but just like having DA's in your system they do have to load AFA Gene Regarding the rel-pitch, it actually changes the waveform, Mike? Nuzz No, it doesn't change the sample, it just compensates for different rates. It actually changes the pitch that the sample is played back as. The digitize Xcmd in the stack is also portable so you can place it in any other stack and digitize sounds from there as well ELECTMUSIC How big is each of the rsound files? DanW190 Where are the sounds themselves stored, or more accurately, which files are the resources added to? I.e.. in the HCGS stacks are the sounds stored in resource forks? Nuzz Thats like saying how big is a program Greg. Dan, you can attach the sounds to _any_ file. And yes they are resource sounds that can be used from HCGS or System 6. DanW190 So then it's a "Genesys" of sounds? Nuzz System 6 lets you assign sounds to different events like startup, shutdown trash fill, sysbeep, etc AFC Eddie What part of Sys 6 lets you do that, Mike? AFC Eddie Is it a CDev? Nuzz Dan, only in the fact that it works on resource sounds but easier to use DanW190 lol :) ELECTMUSIC Ohh Sorry Mike, I was thinking about System software sounds... do you mean that these sounds are open ended in terms of their length? AFC Eddie No, Mike, I meant the part of Sys 6 that lets you assign sounds to events. Nuzz Sure Greg, just like other sound formats DanW190 Eddie - that's a CDEV Nuzz there is no limitation on size AFC Eddie I wonder if that's the part of Sys 6 that conflicts with MTPro... AFA Gene Is there any compatibility factor with Macintosh Hypercard? Nuzz My system plays sounds for most events.. Really cool DanW190 (System 6.0 doesn't work with MtPro? Oops) :) AFC Eddie Only if you substitute an ancient Tool 32, Dan. At least for the beta version I tried. Nuzz Not in the initial version Gene, but that is something we are going to have, ELECTMUSIC But Mike... I can't see taking more time for booting up the system just to have sound effects for different Icons Nuzz as well as SoundBlaster VOC files for MSDOs AFC Eddie VOC? Nuzz VOC is a MSDOS file type AFC Eddie Thanks. Nuzz Greg, why have DA's then? And the delay is hardly noticable. In system 6, you would have a sound folder located in your system folder. You select the event type aand the sound to play from a list of available events and sounds. AFC Eddie Does the sound folder come with Sys 6? DanW190 And what again, does the NDA in SoundConvert do? Digitize? Nuzz System 6 introduces sound requests too. Yes, the NDA digitizes and saves in various formats. we are also working on a rSound Editor for the upcoming "Foundation". That's a resource shell that will edit, support clipboard cut, copy, etc That will be free to existing SC owners. DanW190 Will it convert stuff that you don't need to digitize? (i.e. convert pre-existing files) in the NDA? Nuzz Dan, no, the stack does that and the rSound editor will too ELECTMUSIC Mike, IMHO, DA's are utilities that should be helpful to the user, Their NOT Effects....Unless I am missing something here AFC Eddie That editor sounds nice! DanW190 Sounds very cool :) Nuzz It is cool. It supports multiple editing windows DanW190 Ok, sounds even COOLER! :) Nuzz You can have 5 sounds wave forms on the screen at the same time, and cut and paste between the 5 AFC Eddie Wow! AFA Gene Very useful! DanW190 What are the editing features of SoundConvert? AFC Eddie Combined with SC, that sounds like a complete package! Nuzz The System 6 sound control panel supports clipboard sounds too AFA Gene Will the "foundation" program also be HCGS stack-based or will it be a S16 application? Nuzz The only editing features of the stack is to change the rSound Header, rename sounds, and delete sounds and move sounds. Foundation is a full fledged resource editor from Lunar Productions. It is more a shell that modules can be added to (like a sound module) That is not due out for a few more months ELECTMUSIC Mike getting back to the System Sounds... outside of effects why would I want to increase my boot time to have these sound effects in there? AFC Eddie Well, just the important people are left! Nuzz Greg, I'm surprised at you! ELECTMUSIC :) Nuzz Why listen to music? AFC Eddie Hmmmmmmmm. Nuzz and besides its really nice to have different sounds associated with different events ELECTMUSIC Well... I said I might be missing something... AFC Eddie Well, there are lots of users who like that "Cutesy" kinda stuff. Nuzz You're caught up in boot time. I don't notice the delay ELECTMUSIC If my boot up time is going to be increased by 30 seconds , then I might consider leaving my music to a specific program like HStudio Nuzz I'm one of those Cutsey users :) I don't have Gettsburg address length sounds either :) AFC Eddie I like that stuff too, but inits and CDevs that play sounds ALWAYS conflict with MTPRO. Nuzz system 6 does not conflict in that way. Very nice implementation AFA Gene Does Expressload help at all with the rSound file format? AFC Eddie Maybe the final won't, but the beta I tried did. ELECTMUSIC How big are your rsound files in Sys 6.0? Nuzz IMO all other inits, etc are doomed when 6 comes out Nuzz Small, Greg, more like little musical notes. 4-6 K in most cases AFC Eddie yeah, dotted whole notes! Nuzz doorbell, ah, whoosh, etc AFC Eddie That's not too bad. ELECTMUSIC Yea....Thats ok... I was thinking of 10k per sound AFA Gene Well, for the record, thanks for coming Mike, we've learned a lot of new info tonight :) Nuzz The system 6 launcher program probably screws up "quitter" type programs AFC Eddie Yes, it does. AFC Eddie Is that why when I quit from certain apps , I go to the launcher instead of the Finder? Nuzz Eddie, yes AFC Eddie Ah! ELECTMUSIC Is that going to be fixed? Nuzz But it is the apps fault not sysytem 6, nothing broken Greg ELECTMUSIC Guess your right Mike.... Nuzz rSounds are cool, and when system 6 comes out, you are going to be asked lots of questions AFC Eddie Mike, why not write us a little tutorial on them? Nuzz mainly, how can I get rSounds ELECTMUSIC Mike... sorry to ask you to repeat this, How is rsounds and SoundConvert going to be used in HStudio? Nuzz Greg, I _Think_ HS 3.0 will use rSounds, but I haven't tried it HCGS and system 6 can use HS sounds converted with SC AFC Eddie Mike, thanks for coming by and filling us in on the latest SC news! And thanks for supporting the GS! Nuzz my pleasure ELECTMUSIC Thanks Mike AFC Eddie -------------------------- Log Off-------------------------